injector scaling/latency chart

[evonut270]

as title how about setting up a chart with various sizes and latencys?

[jamie_v1]

Good idea or just post up tried and tested scalings and latencys

[evonut270]

Good idea or just post up tried and tested scalings and latencys
yeah that would be a good idea.

[AndyF]

Std E3 510cc injector settings:

Scaling: 511 cc/min

Latency: 4.056, 1.944, 1.272, 0.912, 0.696, 0.576, 0.48

Andy

[Russ]

http://injector-rehab.com/kbse/lag.htm

;)

[merlin]

Extract from "Merlins EcuFlash EVO Tuning Guide"


2.2-INJECTOR TUNING EXAMPLES - SCALING & LATENCY

The table below shows SCALING and LATENCY values as submitted by various members of the EVO community, mainly from the USA. These values were worked out for typically 93 octane fuel, using 98-100 octane or ethanol blends may require variations.

Table 3 TYPICAL INJECTOR SCALING AND LATENCY PARAMETERS

- - LATENCY in mSEC / BATTERY VOLTAGE
TYPE SCALING 4.7V 7.0V 9.4V 11.7V 14.0V 16.4V 18.6V
EVO 9 511 3.312 1.680 1.032 0.672 0.432 0.264 0.144
PTE_680 - 3.312 2.186 1.413 0.957 0.687 0.486 0.349
PTE_680 622 3.888 2.136 1.440 1.056 0.812 0.624 0.480
PTE_680 650 3.312 2.184 1.416 0.960 0.690 0.480 0.360
PTE_780 - 3.312 2.186 1.369 0.895 0.610 0.419 0.290
PTE_780 609 3.312 1.680 1.032 0.672 0.432 0.264 0.144
PTE_780 680 3.504 1.872 1.224 0.960 0.774 0.552 0.432
PTE_880 - 3.312 2.186 1.325 0.883 0.534 0.351 0.231
PTE_880 770 3.312 2.304 1.392 1.008 0.792 0.600 0.504
PTE_880 790 3.312 2.184 1.320 0.840 0.672 0.360 0.240
PTE_880 790 3.624 1.992 1.344 0.984 0.744 0.576 0.456
PTE1000 - 3.312 2.186 1.281 0.771 0.458 0.283 0.172
MSD_750 - 3.312 2.186 1.302 0.781 0.452 0.256 0.126
RC_720 - 3.312 2.186 1.518 1.032 0.694 0.443 0.268
RC_1000 - 3.312 2.023 1.079 0.641 0.376 0.181 0.049
RC_1000 914 3.312 2.184 1.560 0.912 0.600 0.321 0.240
RC_1000 835 3.312 2.184 1.560 0.936 0.624 0.384 0.288
RC_1200 - 3.312 2.186 2.085 1.581 1.060 0.713 0.471
HOLL780 - 3.312 1.903 0.952 0.573 0.353 0.193 0.093
HKS1000 - 3.312 2.109 1.189 0.812 0.583 0.382 0.248
FIC_650 - 3.312 2.100 1.071 0.633 0.353 0.175 0.044
FIC_850 - 3.312 2.031 0.971 0.591 0.334 0.195 0.106
FIC_950 - 3.312 2.186 1.220 0.706 0.425 0.274 0.175
FIC1150 1125 4.512 3.408 1.896 1.320 0.936 0.672 0.480
BR1000 665 3.312 1.680 1.392 1.104 0.960 0.696 0.504
DEN720 636 6.120 3.120 1.992 1.320 0.888 0.672 0.408
DEN660 636 6.120 3.120 1.992 1.320 0.888 0.672 0.408

Note 1: All entries have reported as yielding good tuned results on evolutionm.net.

[Cossie1]

my PTE 680cc Settings.

Scaled to 650cc

Volts:

4.6875
7.03125
9.375
11.7188
14.0625
16.4062
18.6768

Latancy:

3.312
2.184
1.416
0.960
0.696
0.480
0.360

[jamie_v1]

Some settings i have found that work

RC750 scaled to 696

4.69v 3.312
7.03v 2.184
9.38v 1.416
11.72v 1.032
14.06v 0.792
16.41v 0.480
18.68v 0.360

RC1000 scaled to 943

4.69v 3.312
7.03v 2.184
9.38v 1.560
11.72v 1.056
14.06v 0.720
16.41v 0.480
18.68v 0.360

[SPAWN]

My PTE 780cc


4.74v 4.296

7.11v 2.448

9.48v 1.560

11.85v 0.984

14.22v 0.624

16.59v 0.456

18.89v 0.312



Scaling: 750

[evonut270]

nice work lads.:smile:

[wip]

Extract from "Merlins EcuFlash EVO Tuning Guide"

........

PTE_880 - 3.312 2.186 1.325 0.883 0.534 0.351 0.231
PTE_880 770 3.312 2.304 1.392 1.008 0.792 0.600 0.504
PTE_880 790 3.312 2.184 1.320 0.840 0.672 0.360 0.240
PTE_880 790 3.624 1.992 1.344 0.984 0.744 0.576 0.456
........




Having read through the rather large thread over on the 'other' forum about injector scaling/latency, I was wondering if anyone had any updated figures regarding the above injectors?

Cheers :smile:

[wip]

Having read through the rather large thread over on the 'other' forum about injector scaling/latency, I was wondering if anyone had any updated figures regarding the above injectors?

Cheers :smile:

If anyone else has these injectors, these settings are spot on (less than +/- 1% in evoscan, 0 in mitsulogger)

PTE 880 - Scaled at 812

3.216
2.184
1.416
0.96
0.672
0.48
0.336

:smile:

Just out of curiosity, is there anything else that needs changing in the rom when switching to larger injectors other than the scaling and latency?

I ask as i now have a mildly annoying problem, the car starts fine when hot or cold, but if the temp is somewhere in the middle, it takes quite a lot of cranking. A slight dab on the throttle usually sorts it though.

Any ideas are welcome :confused1:

[wip]

If anyone else has these injectors, these settings are spot on (less than +/- 1% in evoscan, 0 in mitsulogger)

PTE 880 - Scaled at 812

3.216
2.184
1.416
0.96
0.672
0.48
0.336
:smile:

Just out of curiosity, is there anything else that needs changing in the rom when switching to larger injectors other than the scaling and latency?

I ask as i now have a mildly annoying problem, the car starts fine when hot or cold, but if the temp is somewhere in the middle, it takes quite a lot of cranking. A slight dab on the throttle usually sorts it though.

Any ideas are welcome :confused1:

Anyone? Pleeease, It's getting quite annoying now having to crank it for so long :confused1:

[jcsbanks]

Perhaps your 790 scaling is a bit high considering you are lean on WOT and probably lean on medium temperature starting. Cold start enrichment is so strong it might be masking a lean effect.

[wip]

Perhaps your 790 scaling is a bit high considering you are lean on WOT and probably lean on medium temperature starting. Cold start enrichment is so strong it might be masking a lean effect.

The fuelling in the maps is almost unchanged from before i fitted the PTEs.

I aim for 11.5 from peak onwards.

I did try some other settings whereby the scaling was 770, but after logging the trims i decided to try the aforementioned settings which yeilded good results straight away. It sounds like I'm going to have to log them again, using mitsulogger to verify the trim numbers.

I don't know wether or not it is connected but at light load shifts, i get a judder as if it is majorly overfuelling or pulling massive amounts of timing.

Logs show nothing :confused1: AFR obviously goes through the roof as I'm lifting...

As i said before, I'm a little new to this but i have a thirst to learn :smile:
And this is really bugging me.

Thanks for the reply, I'll try and do a little more digging and logging :smile:

[wip]

OK, well, i finally found 'my' optimum settings for the injectors :smile:

*Info above changed*

Although the scaling does seem a tad high, I'm now getting +/- 0.6% in low and middle using Evoscan (sometimes jumps to 1.5-ish), and 0 for both in Mitsulogger (sometimes 1) :smile:

I also solved the 'bogging/bucking' under light load shifts. I put all the standard ALS settings in, and it's now gone. It definitely didn't do it before fitting the injectors.

I still have the warm start thing :angry::confused1:

[GrayW]

Also see the link posted by Russ on post #3 Clicky (http://injector-rehab.com/kbse/lag.htm).

[nitz01]

i just recently ran into a similar problem on a X. it was only good on cold starts or quick restarts when warm. it seemed as though the injectors were dripping fuel at times flooding the cylinder and giving the hard start. sent them in for testing and sure enough one of them leaked unpredictably and the set was replaced. might be worth checking for your issue.

I still have the warm start thing :angry::confused1:

[scandinavian flick]

OK, well, i finally found 'my' optimum settings for the injectors :smile:

*Info above changed*

Although the scaling does seem a tad high, I'm now getting +/- 0.6% in low and middle using Evoscan (sometimes jumps to 1.5-ish), and 0 for both in Mitsulogger (sometimes 1) :smile:

I also solved the 'bogging/bucking' under light load shifts. I put all the standard ALS settings in, and it's now gone. It definitely didn't do it before fitting the injectors.

I still have the warm start thing :angry::confused1:


Are you still getting this problem, as i'm getting it with my rc750 setup. Trims are fine cold start & hot start is fine but if i've left the car for say half -1hour it takes longer to start?? :confused1:

[GrayW]

How much longer on warm start does it take?

[scandinavian flick]

If a normal start is say 1-2 seconds,it must be 3ish it's not loads and it does very a little.
Gray have you set rc 750s up?

[wip]

i just recently ran into a similar problem on a X. it was only good on cold starts or quick restarts when warm. it seemed as though the injectors were dripping fuel at times flooding the cylinder and giving the hard start. sent them in for testing and sure enough one of them leaked unpredictably and the set was replaced. might be worth checking for your issue.

That's gonna be a last resort I reckon, cheers for the 'prompt' :smile:

Are you still getting this problem, as i'm getting it with my rc750 setup. Trims are fine cold start & hot start is fine but if i've left the car for say half -1hour it takes longer to start?? :confused1:

Yep, still doing it, I've tried just about everything now....

Fiddled with the 9v latency,
Fiddled with the cranking primer enrichment,
Fiddled with the post primer enrichment....
Fiddled with various other stuff such as the ISCV (evom thread)

I guess I'm all fiddled out :smile:


How much longer on warm start does it take?

Dependent on time left, ranges from a couple of extra cranks, to around 4 seconds for mine.

Sometimes a dab on the throttle seems to help a bit.

[scandinavian flick]

Dependent on time left, ranges from a couple of extra cranks, to around 4 seconds for mine.

Sometimes a dab on the throttle seems to help a bit.[/QUOTE]



Sounds very much like what i'm getting.....

[GrayW]

If a normal start is say 1-2 seconds,it must be 3ish it's not loads and it does very a little.
Gray have you set rc 750s up?

Lots of them, where do you think the settings Jamie supplied came from:p

Not had a car do the same thing on the 750's as you.

[scandinavian flick]

Gray the basis of my setup was from Jamie / (GrayW) :lol:values. When Jamie was using 750s he mentioned to me he was runing 3.5bar fuel pressure. My stock setup would be just under 3bar think. Do you have any stock reg 750 setup values I could try:blushing:

Cheers
J

[jamie_v1]

Gray the basis of my setup was from Jamie / (GrayW) :lol:values. When Jamie was using 750s he mentioned to me he was runing 3.5bar fuel pressure. My stock setup would be just under 3bar think. Do you have any stock reg 750 setup values I could try:blushing:

Cheers
J

If your trims are within spec then there is no point using different settings as there are going to knock your trims out because the settings you have in there already are correct or your trims would be out

If you can try a set of stock injectors in with stock scalings and latencys and see if that cures your fault but if your only cranking for 3 secs then it starts i dont think you have a problem

I used the settings Gray gave me as a base i adjusted them from the ones he supplied till i got the trims within spec it took a while but it was intresting seeing what diffrent settings had the trims

[scandinavian flick]

Jamie, I think the best thing I can do is go out & log trims just to make sure everything is still OK.
Thanks Jamie...

Jon :smile:

[jamie_v1]

Jamie, I think the best thing I can do is go out & log trims just to make sure everything is still OK.
Thanks Jamie...

Jon :smile:

Yes that would be a good thing to do before you go any further :smile:

[John F]

After a lot of fiddling with with the settings of my RC750 injectors I ended up with these.

http://www.architectsoffice.co.uk/johnsimages/trims.png

After three commutes into Edinburgh and back, trims have settled at +0.7 low and -2.5 mid. This drive is a good combination of motorway cruise and start-stop traffic. Low trim is very stable but mid will vary slightly depending on cruise speed. I found that adjusting latency by only 0.05 was enough to change low trims by 6 points and mid trim 3 points.

Many times I thought I had dialled the trims in fine but after a few days driving they were way off. I also had hot start problems when the latencies were higher. I figure the car was getting too much fuel.

The only issue I have is that on cold starts the car will rev up to 2300rpm for a minute and then slowly drop back down to normal idle speed. Does anyone know if there is a definition for sorting this in 96530006?

[scandinavian flick]

Hi John, which program are you using to log? I'm using Mitsilogger & scantech. I got trims sorted yesterday. It's as if the injectors needed to "run in" low trim was out by upto -7. It's within 5 now by lifting the latency to 713. I still a have warm start issue. I'm going to have fettle with the 9v area today.

You got me lookin at WI now.....

[GrayW]

Injector scale will adjust the idle trim, latency's effect the cruise, and they both have an effect on each other. Let it idle in closed loop and see what the trim ends up at. Good tip is to ensure you reset the battery before starting.

[scandinavian flick]

Idle trim was going upto -7 in scantech after 3 cycles or so & hanging around there. Changed to 713 which made it fluctuate within +/-5. tests where carried out after battery was disconnected. Cruise in mitsilogger was 0. Gray do trims work in evoscan 2.6 i've not tried it yet?

[GrayW]

Not sure after I found they did not work right in Evoscan I started using Mitsilogger again.

[John F]

I've used both Mitsulogger and Evoscan 2.5 to log trims. They both gave the same results. Trims do change a little depending on driving conditions. For instance, the other day I took the car into work. When I left the house trims were +0.7,-2.5, when I got to work trims were +2.3,-0.7 and when I got back home trims were +1.1,-0.7. During the drive, cruise trim hit -4.5 at one point while in traffic, and idle got as low as -2.5.

I wonder if it is possible to have different combinations of latency and scaling that will give trims of +or- 5. A high scaling seems to require a low latency while a low scaling requires a high latency. My car drives OK with how I have the injectors set up bit I don't think it is as good as it drove with the stock injectors. There seems to be a little run on as when I take my foot of the throttle it is as if I can feel the injectors cut off and then come back on and I feel a slight bit of acceleration when I shouldn't.

My fuel map is also a lot different with the RC750s. I've also got problems trying to increase fuel in the new map in the 3500 to 5000 areas. Making the numbers lower just doesn't seem to be doing much. The top map is standard injectors, bottom map RC750s.

http://www.architectsoffice.co.uk/johnsimages/fuel maps rc750.png

[donner]

Does anybody know latencies and scaling for Evo 4 original yellow injectors?